temperature change-which side do you fish?

bajakian · 05-20-2007, 06:03 AM

I know that fish prefer cooler or water water at certain times of the year. I was out trolling yesterday and found that the water was atleast half degree warmer at the edge of the gulf stream. The stream was 82.4 and the inshore water was 81.7 degrees. Which side of the temperature change would you fish and why? There was scattered grass both inside and in the stream and only a few scattered flyers here and there. My guess is that the fish are OK in either of these temperatures and will follow the bait, but I was wondering what everybody else thought. Is there an optimal temperature or range of temperatures for dolphin?

mneptune · 05-20-2007, 09:52 AM

Hope this helps answer your question:

Each species of offshore game fish has a water temperature range they prefer, and a wider range outside of which they will seldom be found. The following is a list of these temperatures for gamefish species found off of the southeastern US coast.

SPECIES LOW HIGH OPTIMAL
Blackfin Tuna 70 82 74-76
Bluefin Tuna 50 78 60-68
Blue Marlin 70 88 75-78
Bonita Tuna 60 80 64
Dolphin Fish 70 82 75-78
King Mackerel 70 88 75
Sailfish 70 82 75-78
Spanish Mackerel 68 88 72-82
Yellowfin Tuna 64 80 72-73
Wahoo 70 86 72-77

Rips - Finding Sea Surface "Structures"

Rips are visible disturbances on the water's surface that appear as long, narrow bands of calm water bracketed on either side by rough water.
Rips form at or near temperature boundaries. These boundaries are called soft edges when the change across them is only 1/2°F to 1°F, and hard edges when the change is 2°F to 4°F or more. The rough water at hard edge rips is more pronounced than that at soft edges.

Game fish tend to gather along rips for several reasons:
Plankton gathers along temperature boundaries, setting up a food chain that draws bait to the area. NOTE: Plankton tends to concentrate on the cool side of a rip. This is because coastal water has a higher nutrient content and lower salinity level than Gulf Stream core water. The higher nutrient content in coastal water provides plankton with a food source, and the higher salinity level in Gulf Stream water makes this water denser than coastal water, in effect creating a barrier that the floating plankton cannot cross. Because plankton (and the nutrients on which it feeds) clouds the water, sight oriented hunters like marlin and tuna will tend to stay on the warm side of rips. Floating weeds and debris will collect in the calm area of rips. Floating debris attracts bait, which attract game fish. The shade from floating debris also attracts some game fish, especially dolphin. Temperature boundaries, especially hard edges, can act as a "wall" when the temperature on one side falls within a game fish's comfort range and that on the other side does not. Game fish will tend to move along these edges when they encounter them instead of crossing them.

The most productive rips are those over good bottom structure. These should be explored first. When you encounter rips along the edge of the Gulf Stream or one of its edge features, it is often most productive to continue running perpendicular to those first rips, watching subsequent rips for better formed weed lines and/or signs of actively feeding fish, such as feeding birds.
Concentrate on rips containing floating debris and/or bait. If there have been reports of weed lines in an area, remember that things are moving out there. The western edge of the Gulf Stream has its fastest current, which is north at between 2 and 4 knots.

Weed lines that are not holding bait seldom hold gamefish. Always pull up to a weed line and check for bait before beginning to fish it.
Lures should be trolled along the edge of rips. Because the Gulf Stream flows north, and fish tend to swim with the current, trolling from south to north along rips gives lures a more natural presentation when that rip is along the edge of the Gulf Stream. Rips along the western edges of fingers or warm eddies, however, should be trolled from north to south because the currents in these features move in a circular counterclockwise direction.

B767 · 05-20-2007, 11:04 AM

Thx a mil Capt. Good info.

mneptune · 05-20-2007, 02:13 PM

I guess I have to correct one thing here. I listed the temp range for "Bonita Tuna". To be techincal, and I know I am splitting hairs, Bonita are actually members of the Mackerel family not the Tuna family of fish.

B767 · 05-20-2007, 02:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mneptune

I guess I have to correct one thing here. I listed the temp range for "Bonita Tuna". To be techincal, and I know I am splitting hares, Bonita are actually members of the Mackerel family not the Tuna family of fish.

Well,,,,, don't let it happen again, ok?

Thanks again for really good info though.

miamiangler1 · 05-20-2007, 03:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bajakian

I know that fish prefer cooler or water water at certain times of the year. I was out trolling yesterday and found that the water was atleast half degree warmer at the edge of the gulf stream. The stream was 82.4 and the inshore water was 81.7 degrees. Which side of the temperature change would you fish and why? There was scattered grass both inside and in the stream and only a few scattered flyers here and there. My guess is that the fish are OK in either of these temperatures and will follow the bait, but I was wondering what everybody else thought. Is there an optimal temperature or range of temperatures for dolphin?

I found a nice rip out at 780ft little weeds and bait fish ... trolled the western edge ... did great .. also the dolphin where on the western side 300 yds from the rip

bajakian · 05-20-2007, 07:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mneptune

Hope this helps answer your question:

Each species of offshore game fish has a water temperature range they prefer, and a wider range outside of which they will seldom be found. The following is a list of these temperatures for gamefish species found off of the southeastern US coast.

SPECIES LOW HIGH OPTIMAL
Blackfin Tuna 70 82 74-76
Bluefin Tuna 50 78 60-68
Blue Marlin 70 88 75-78
Bonita Tuna 60 80 64
Dolphin Fish 70 82 75-78
King Mackerel 70 88 75
Sailfish 70 82 75-78
Spanish Mackerel 68 88 72-82
Yellowfin Tuna 64 80 72-73
Wahoo 70 86 72-77

Rips - Finding Sea Surface "Structures"

Rips are visible disturbances on the water's surface that appear as long, narrow bands of calm water bracketed on either side by rough water.
Rips form at or near temperature boundaries. These boundaries are called soft edges when the change across them is only 1/2°F to 1°F, and hard edges when the change is 2°F to 4°F or more. The rough water at hard edge rips is more pronounced than that at soft edges.

Game fish tend to gather along rips for several reasons:
Plankton gathers along temperature boundaries, setting up a food chain that draws bait to the area. NOTE: Plankton tends to concentrate on the cool side of a rip. This is because coastal water has a higher nutrient content and lower salinity level than Gulf Stream core water. The higher nutrient content in coastal water provides plankton with a food source, and the higher salinity level in Gulf Stream water makes this water denser than coastal water, in effect creating a barrier that the floating plankton cannot cross. Because plankton (and the nutrients on which it feeds) clouds the water, sight oriented hunters like marlin and tuna will tend to stay on the warm side of rips. Floating weeds and debris will collect in the calm area of rips. Floating debris attracts bait, which attract game fish. The shade from floating debris also attracts some game fish, especially dolphin. Temperature boundaries, especially hard edges, can act as a "wall" when the temperature on one side falls within a game fish's comfort range and that on the other side does not. Game fish will tend to move along these edges when they encounter them instead of crossing them.

The most productive rips are those over good bottom structure. These should be explored first. When you encounter rips along the edge of the Gulf Stream or one of its edge features, it is often most productive to continue running perpendicular to those first rips, watching subsequent rips for better formed weed lines and/or signs of actively feeding fish, such as feeding birds.
Concentrate on rips containing floating debris and/or bait. If there have been reports of weed lines in an area, remember that things are moving out there. The western edge of the Gulf Stream has its fastest current, which is north at between 2 and 4 knots.

Weed lines that are not holding bait seldom hold gamefish. Always pull up to a weed line and check for bait before beginning to fish it.
Lures should be trolled along the edge of rips. Because the Gulf Stream flows north, and fish tend to swim with the current, trolling from south to north along rips gives lures a more natural presentation when that rip is along the edge of the Gulf Stream. Rips along the western edges of fingers or warm eddies, however, should be trolled from north to south because the currents in these features move in a circular counterclockwise direction.

That was an amazing response, so well written and so informative. It is posts like this and members like you that make this site so special. Thanks for your input.

mneptune · 05-20-2007, 08:45 PM

I am glad that you found this information useful, but before anyone gets to greatful, I must point out that I did not originate this information. I found the information on a website and just wanted to pass it along in a attempt to answer your inquiry.

This information is extremely accurate, which I can attest to personally..

bajakian · 05-21-2007, 07:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mneptune

I am glad that you found this information useful, but before anyone gets to greatful, I must point out that I did not originate this information. I found the information on a website and just wanted to pass it along in a attempt to answer your inquiry.

This information is extremely accurate, which I can attest to personally..

Capt Neptune, what is the source? Do you have a link to the website?

Thanks again!

mneptune · 05-21-2007, 07:27 AM

Bajakian,

Check out HotSpots Charts, LLC Saltwater Fishing Charts & FREE Sea Surface Temperature Charts

bajakian · 05-21-2007, 02:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mneptune

Bajakian,

Check out HotSpots Charts, LLC Saltwater Fishing Charts & FREE Sea Surface Temperature Charts

Pretty cool site Captain. Thanks for the link. Do you use the SST s in your fishing and do you find that it is helpful?

mneptune · 05-21-2007, 04:36 PM

Bajakian,

I absolutely use SST charts. I reference them prior to every trip. As mentioned, temperature breaks normally show rips etc. You can get a very good estimate of where the temp breaks and rip lines are by referencing these charts before leaving the dock.

They are particulary valuable during the summer months here. A change of only 1/4 to 1/2 degree in temperature can make all the difference between filets on the table and going home with an empty box.

A very important part of my post was finding weeds and drebis. It is very important that when you find "surface structure" that it has bait fish, crabs, shrimp, etc. on it. I refer to a sargassum line or debris with bait as having "character". If these floating structures do not have "character", I will run down the line for a short period to determine how void it is. If I do not see bait I don't put out my spread, I will keep serching for the next line until I find one with the "character" I am looking for.

B767 · 05-21-2007, 06:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mneptune

I am glad that you found this information useful, but before anyone gets to greatful, I must point out that I did not originate this information. I found the information on a website and just wanted to pass it along in a attempt to answer your inquiry.

This information is extremely accurate, which I can attest to personally..

It is still GREATLY appreciated. Once again thx.

wearevermx · 05-23-2007, 06:55 PM

Yo Really Did Your Homework, Great Job, Very Interesting And Important Information, Mneptune

mneptune · 05-23-2007, 09:43 PM

No problemo.............

DIRTYFOOT2 · 05-24-2007, 06:49 PM

Sweet post Mnep. Thanks fer sharin...........

On Island Time · 05-30-2007, 09:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mneptune

Bajakian,

Check out HotSpots Charts, LLC Saltwater Fishing Charts & FREE Sea Surface Temperature Charts

Love that site. MNeptune...outstanding answer to the 1st question

mneptune · 05-30-2007, 10:07 AM

I am happy that my neighbors on this site is finding the information usefull. Keep in mind that the website link for SST's is only ONE source for information. There are several other sites that have great information as well. One that shows promise is Sea Surface Temperature Charts for better fishing by Oceantemp.com. It is a pay service and looks interesting. They will be coming on-line in the lower southeast area this summer and I am looking forward to what they may have to offer.

On Island Time · 06-06-2007, 09:36 PM

MNeptune...Here is another site I use occassionly. Not as good as HotSpots LLC, but nonetheless another temp site.

Sea Surface Temperature - IMCS Marine Remote Sensing

Whats your take on this one?

05-20-2007, 06:03 AM	#1 (permalink)
bajakian Hooked Up Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Ocean Ridge, Fl Boat: Venture 34 Best Catch: 300 lb Yellow fin Tuna, Blue Marlin 240 lbs on 30 lb test, 423 lb Swordfish Occupation: MD Posts: 913	temperature change-which side do you fish? I know that fish prefer cooler or water water at certain times of the year. I was out trolling yesterday and found that the water was atleast half degree warmer at the edge of the gulf stream. The stream was 82.4 and the inshore water was 81.7 degrees. Which side of the temperature change would you fish and why? There was scattered grass both inside and in the stream and only a few scattered flyers here and there. My guess is that the fish are OK in either of these temperatures and will follow the bait, but I was wondering what everybody else thought. Is there an optimal temperature or range of temperatures for dolphin?

05-20-2007, 09:52 AM	#2 (permalink)
mneptune Hooked Up Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Palm Beach Boat: Grady White 25' CC Best Catch: She won't let me talk about her on here Occupation: good ole SOB Posts: 298	Hope this helps answer your question: Each species of offshore game fish has a water temperature range they prefer, and a wider range outside of which they will seldom be found. The following is a list of these temperatures for gamefish species found off of the southeastern US coast. SPECIES LOW HIGH OPTIMAL Blackfin Tuna 70 82 74-76 Bluefin Tuna 50 78 60-68 Blue Marlin 70 88 75-78 Bonita Tuna 60 80 64 Dolphin Fish 70 82 75-78 King Mackerel 70 88 75 Sailfish 70 82 75-78 Spanish Mackerel 68 88 72-82 Yellowfin Tuna 64 80 72-73 Wahoo 70 86 72-77 Rips - Finding Sea Surface "Structures" Rips are visible disturbances on the water's surface that appear as long, narrow bands of calm water bracketed on either side by rough water. Rips form at or near temperature boundaries. These boundaries are called soft edges when the change across them is only 1/2°F to 1°F, and hard edges when the change is 2°F to 4°F or more. The rough water at hard edge rips is more pronounced than that at soft edges. Game fish tend to gather along rips for several reasons: Plankton gathers along temperature boundaries, setting up a food chain that draws bait to the area. NOTE: Plankton tends to concentrate on the cool side of a rip. This is because coastal water has a higher nutrient content and lower salinity level than Gulf Stream core water. The higher nutrient content in coastal water provides plankton with a food source, and the higher salinity level in Gulf Stream water makes this water denser than coastal water, in effect creating a barrier that the floating plankton cannot cross. Because plankton (and the nutrients on which it feeds) clouds the water, sight oriented hunters like marlin and tuna will tend to stay on the warm side of rips. Floating weeds and debris will collect in the calm area of rips. Floating debris attracts bait, which attract game fish. The shade from floating debris also attracts some game fish, especially dolphin. Temperature boundaries, especially hard edges, can act as a "wall" when the temperature on one side falls within a game fish's comfort range and that on the other side does not. Game fish will tend to move along these edges when they encounter them instead of crossing them. The most productive rips are those over good bottom structure. These should be explored first. When you encounter rips along the edge of the Gulf Stream or one of its edge features, it is often most productive to continue running perpendicular to those first rips, watching subsequent rips for better formed weed lines and/or signs of actively feeding fish, such as feeding birds. Concentrate on rips containing floating debris and/or bait. If there have been reports of weed lines in an area, remember that things are moving out there. The western edge of the Gulf Stream has its fastest current, which is north at between 2 and 4 knots. Weed lines that are not holding bait seldom hold gamefish. Always pull up to a weed line and check for bait before beginning to fish it. Lures should be trolled along the edge of rips. Because the Gulf Stream flows north, and fish tend to swim with the current, trolling from south to north along rips gives lures a more natural presentation when that rip is along the edge of the Gulf Stream. Rips along the western edges of fingers or warm eddies, however, should be trolled from north to south because the currents in these features move in a circular counterclockwise direction. __________________ I FISH THEREFORE IAM Last edited by mneptune : 05-20-2007 at 02:03 PM.

05-20-2007, 11:04 AM	#3 (permalink)
B767 Hooked Up Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Miami Boat: VSC, Old Hatt Occupation: Bus Driver Posts: 407	Thx a mil Capt. Good info. __________________ Life on the water is good, and beer makes it better

05-20-2007, 02:13 PM	#4 (permalink)
mneptune Hooked Up Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Palm Beach Boat: Grady White 25' CC Best Catch: She won't let me talk about her on here Occupation: good ole SOB Posts: 298	I guess I have to correct one thing here. I listed the temp range for "Bonita Tuna". To be techincal, and I know I am splitting hairs, Bonita are actually members of the Mackerel family not the Tuna family of fish. __________________ I FISH THEREFORE IAM Last edited by mneptune : 05-24-2007 at 01:25 PM.

05-20-2007, 08:45 PM	#8 (permalink)
mneptune Hooked Up Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Palm Beach Boat: Grady White 25' CC Best Catch: She won't let me talk about her on here Occupation: good ole SOB Posts: 298	I am glad that you found this information useful, but before anyone gets to greatful, I must point out that I did not originate this information. I found the information on a website and just wanted to pass it along in a attempt to answer your inquiry. This information is extremely accurate, which I can attest to personally.. __________________ I FISH THEREFORE IAM

05-21-2007, 07:27 AM	#10 (permalink)
mneptune Hooked Up Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Palm Beach Boat: Grady White 25' CC Best Catch: She won't let me talk about her on here Occupation: good ole SOB Posts: 298	Bajakian, Check out HotSpots Charts, LLC Saltwater Fishing Charts & FREE Sea Surface Temperature Charts __________________ I FISH THEREFORE IAM

05-21-2007, 04:36 PM	#12 (permalink)
mneptune Hooked Up Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Palm Beach Boat: Grady White 25' CC Best Catch: She won't let me talk about her on here Occupation: good ole SOB Posts: 298	Bajakian, I absolutely use SST charts. I reference them prior to every trip. As mentioned, temperature breaks normally show rips etc. You can get a very good estimate of where the temp breaks and rip lines are by referencing these charts before leaving the dock. They are particulary valuable during the summer months here. A change of only 1/4 to 1/2 degree in temperature can make all the difference between filets on the table and going home with an empty box. A very important part of my post was finding weeds and drebis. It is very important that when you find "surface structure" that it has bait fish, crabs, shrimp, etc. on it. I refer to a sargassum line or debris with bait as having "character". If these floating structures do not have "character", I will run down the line for a short period to determine how void it is. If I do not see bait I don't put out my spread, I will keep serching for the next line until I find one with the "character" I am looking for. __________________ I FISH THEREFORE IAM Last edited by mneptune : 05-21-2007 at 04:40 PM.

05-23-2007, 06:55 PM	#14 (permalink)
wearevermx Lines In Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: playa del carmen mexico Occupation: Fisheries Engineer Posts: 57	Yo Really Did Your Homework, Great Job, Very Interesting And Important Information, Mneptune __________________ wearevermx

05-23-2007, 09:43 PM	#15 (permalink)
mneptune Hooked Up Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Palm Beach Boat: Grady White 25' CC Best Catch: She won't let me talk about her on here Occupation: good ole SOB Posts: 298	No problemo............. __________________ I FISH THEREFORE IAM

05-24-2007, 06:49 PM	#16 (permalink)
DIRTYFOOT2 Grander Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Lake Worth fl Best Catch: 53lb Black Grouper Occupation: Gunnel Washer Posts: 2,001	Sweet post Mnep. Thanks fer sharin........... __________________ right thumb on the spool, left hand flips the lever

05-30-2007, 10:07 AM	#18 (permalink)
mneptune Hooked Up Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Palm Beach Boat: Grady White 25' CC Best Catch: She won't let me talk about her on here Occupation: good ole SOB Posts: 298	I am happy that my neighbors on this site is finding the information usefull. Keep in mind that the website link for SST's is only ONE source for information. There are several other sites that have great information as well. One that shows promise is Sea Surface Temperature Charts for better fishing by Oceantemp.com. It is a pay service and looks interesting. They will be coming on-line in the lower southeast area this summer and I am looking forward to what they may have to offer. __________________ I FISH THEREFORE IAM

06-06-2007, 09:36 PM	#19 (permalink)
On Island Time Lines In Join Date: May 2007 Location: Castaway Cove Boat: Bluewater 2350 Posts: 50	MNeptune...Here is another site I use occassionly. Not as good as HotSpots LLC, but nonetheless another temp site. Sea Surface Temperature - IMCS Marine Remote Sensing Whats your take on this one? __________________ "On Island Time" Fishing Team